Matthew Perry’s Tragic End: Doctors, Fame, and the Battle with Addiction

 Matthew Perry’s Tragic End: Doctors, Fame, and the Battle with Addiction

In this episode, the hosts discuss the life and tragic death of Matthew Perry, exploring his early life, career, struggles with addiction, health crises, and the impact of enablers in Hollywood. They reflect on his legacy and the lessons learned from his experiences, emphasizing the importance of mental health and support systems. In this conversation, the speakers delve into the troubling dynamics of the medical field, particularly focusing on the darker aspects of addiction and the role of healthcare professionals. They discuss the ketamine controversy surrounding several doctors, the flaws in the rehab system, and the influence of celebrity culture on addiction. The conversation highlights the need for accountability within the healthcare system and the systemic issues that perpetuate addiction.
 
The conversation shifts to Matthew Perry's tragic death at 54, reportedly due to a ketamine overdose and subsequent drowning. Matthews and the podcast hosts explore the role of celebrity culture and unscrupulous doctors in enabling addiction. Harvey Levin’s TMZ Investigates special uncovered that Perry's assistant, Kenneth Iwamasa, injected him with ketamine multiple times on the day of his death, and several doctors are under investigation for their involvement in the underground distribution of ketamine.

Kelly Osbourne also shares her perspective on addiction, recalling a time when Matthew Perry gave her a recovery chip, telling her, "If you can get through 3 minutes, you can get through anything." Osbourne describes how celebrity status often makes doctors more willing to provide prescriptions, and she recounts her own struggles with addiction to doctor-prescribed medications starting as early as 13 years old.

Dr. Drew Pinsky and Dr. Terry Dubrow weigh in on the dangers of doctors who cater to celebrity clients and bend medical ethics for fame or financial gain. Brandon Novak, a former Jackass star and recovery advocate, talks about his own history of trading favors for drugs from doctors. The discussion also touches on Michael Jackson’s death, linking it to his own doctor’s unethical practices.

The podcast closes with reflections on the corrupt nature of some rehab centers, which often enable addicts rather than guide them to true recovery. Matthews emphasizes the need for affordable, authentic treatment, noting that Perry himself highlighted these systemic issues before his death. In this conversation, the speakers discuss the broken rehab system, the intertwining of mental health and addiction, the role of medical professionals in treatment, the financial burden of addiction, the negligence surrounding care, and the stigma associated with addiction. They reflect on the tragic case of Matthew Perry, emphasizing the need for better support and understanding for those struggling with addiction and mental health issues.

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• 20:27 (Cont.) Matthew Perry’s Tragic End: Doctors, Fame, and the Battle with Addiction

Transcript

We Wine Whenever (00:00.717)
Hi, welcome to We Wine Whenever. I'm Wendy.

We Wine Whenever (00:03.55)
I'm Kelly.

We Wine Whenever (00:04.43)
And I'm Lori. Wait, wait, wait. We gotta wait for it. Just wait one second.

We Wine Whenever (00:12.866)
beer. That's my beer popping. Yeah, yeah, that's my beer. It's very important that everyone hear that.

We Wine Whenever (00:15.079)
You got a beer tonight? Okay. I told Wendy I tried something new tonight and went to see Tessie Poet Lovoti's liquor store and I got like a Pinot Grigio Sauvignon Blanc mixed wine tonight. I know. No, it's white, cause they're both white. They're very similar grapes. I like the Sauvignon Blanc a little bit more because it's drier. Yeah, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (00:17.432)
Okay.

We Wine Whenever (00:33.748)
Is it pink in color?

We Wine Whenever (00:41.558)
It's drier, right? Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (00:44.735)
But this is very good. Yeah, I'll tell you something funny later when we stop.

We Wine Whenever (00:46.806)
Interesting. by the way, I'll just mention this now because why not? I mean, we do do a pot about wine. Bill is doing a Costco run next week if we need to put an order in for our wine and other alcoholic beverages that we drink while potting.

We Wine Whenever (00:47.152)
Very nice.

We Wine Whenever (00:55.797)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (00:59.889)
Excellent. Yes.

We Wine Whenever (01:09.02)
There we go. The staples.

We Wine Whenever (01:09.725)
Yeah, let's have a meeting this week and discuss what we need.

We Wine Whenever (01:13.139)
Okay, we'll have to have a business meeting. We'll discuss our supplies that are needed for our business. And yes, sounds like a plan. But tonight we're going to talk about Matthew Perry and the tragic death and the stuff that has surrounded his death that we found out since his passing. And Lori's going to start off with a little bit of the history of, you know, Matthew Perry's beginnings because she did that research.

We Wine Whenever (01:18.313)
Yes. Me. Yeah, perfect.

We Wine Whenever (01:35.103)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (01:43.534)
Yeah, so I always, you know, I'm a friends fanatic. always watch this, you know, I've watched the show all these years and always thought Matthew Perry was funny, but really knew nothing about him. But he was born in 1967 in Massachusetts to John and Suzanne Perry, and they were only married for a little over a year and then they split.

and both of his parents subsequently remarried and had more children with their respective partners and Perry ended up with five siblings but he was the only child of his mother and father and something else that I thought was pretty wild is he was a colicky infant so as an infant he was prescribed phenobarbital for 30 days when he was only a month old.

So back in the day, old school, you know, a lot of times when your kid wouldn't sleep and was colicky, this is something that they would actually do. So, you know, it begs to question if this early introduction to barbiturates led in any way to his later addiction. So that was, yeah, to say the least. So he grew up in Canada with his mom.

We Wine Whenever (02:37.247)
Wow.

We Wine Whenever (02:54.773)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (02:56.907)
That's interesting.

We Wine Whenever (02:58.077)
Yeah, for sure.

We Wine Whenever (03:04.792)
And she was a TV anchor and a press secretary for the prime minister, Pierre Trudeau, before moving to California with his father, who was also an actor. And his dad was the face of Old Spice in all their ad campaigns. So he moved to California. Ooh, Wendy's got friends.

We Wine Whenever (03:25.085)
You know, his father was also.

His father was also in one episode of Friends. Remember the episode where Rachel is dating the guy that she was dressing in the department store, Joshua? Like she had a crush on the guy and they finally go out on a date and they go back to his apartment and his parents come home? The guy who played his father was Matthew Perry's father in real life, right?

We Wine Whenever (03:35.386)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (03:45.552)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (03:53.899)
Okay.

We Wine Whenever (03:57.82)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (03:59.785)
Yeah, yeah, just to put a name, a face to the, know.

We Wine Whenever (04:01.109)
That's interesting.

We Wine Whenever (04:02.454)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. So, you know, kind of as a child, he was kind of shuffled back and forth between both parents, one being in Canada and one being in California. And he even tells a story about how he was put on a plane by himself when he was like five, like his feet didn't even touch the floor. You know, he was sitting in the seat like, the hell is this? So he was like,

a Latke kid and he said in an interview with, I'll have to give you the guy's name later on, but he said that he just was always kind of trailing after his mother wanting her attention and she was super busy with this super important job and never really kind of had time for him. So at 14, he drank his first bottle of wine and he said that he thought

this must be the way that normal people feel all the time. That's how he explained it when he got drunk for the first time like that. And he was actually a nationally ranked tennis player in Canada. And then he appeared in Beverly Hills, nine of two one and then at yeah, 24, he landed his gig with friends.

We Wine Whenever (05:18.293)
I remember that.

We Wine Whenever (05:24.25)
And this is kind of, but he said like one week prior to getting hired, he prayed to God and he asked him to be famous and told God he could do whatever he wanted to in order to be famous. So kind of be careful what you ask for and how you ask for it.

We Wine Whenever (05:51.743)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (05:53.678)
So he was also the last actor to be hired for the series and it earned him one million per episode in seasons nine and 10. So that's a lot of money. $1 million.

We Wine Whenever (06:09.577)
Yeah, because there's over like 20 episodes in those seasons. I wonder what they were making when they first got cast, probably next to nothing, right?

We Wine Whenever (06:13.146)
Mm-hmm. So.

We Wine Whenever (06:18.152)
I looked it up and I forget what it was, but it was, it was no joke, but it was nothing like, you know, what it ended up to be. And then, you know, you have to add onto that several, like millions in endorsements and, royalties.

We Wine Whenever (06:36.063)
Royalties.

We Wine Whenever (06:37.885)
Yeah, mean, God, it's still every day during the day. It's on TBS reruns and every night it's on Nick at night. Still.

We Wine Whenever (06:44.188)
Yes. Mm-hmm. Yep. So in 2000, while he was still on Friends, he starred in the movie The Home on Yards with Bruce Willis. And he was got hurt on a jet ski and he was prescribed Vicodin. And then he's kind of he was always drinking. But then listen to you, sipping away. Yes, right.

We Wine Whenever (07:10.699)
straw! I have a straw! I have to be honest, it's actually an espresso martini. It's not even wine. Switching it up a bit.

We Wine Whenever (07:10.834)
and cheers

We Wine Whenever (07:14.709)
Chen Chen.

We Wine Whenever (07:14.905)
So.

We Wine Whenever (07:18.321)
Good for you. All right.

We Wine Whenever (07:18.504)
there you go. There you go, Switch it up. So when he was in that jet ski accident, he got prescribed Vicodin and then his drug addiction kind of spiraled from there. So while he was on set, he would never drink or do drugs, but he continuously came in like with killer hangovers, like to the point where he would be shaking

so badly that if he had to go a couple feet, he would have to like hold on to furniture and just like work that into his scene just so he can get from point A to point B. Well, it was, yeah, but what he said was he never actually used during his film while working. So,

We Wine Whenever (07:58.187)
Well that doesn't sound like a hangover. That sounds like DT's. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (08:02.035)
Well, like withdrawals, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (08:10.985)
while working.

We Wine Whenever (08:15.26)
You know, he was actually leading an exhausting double life because he, know, the secrets that you keep is what kills you. You know, he didn't let anybody know. So, at one point he was taking 55 Vicodin a day.

We Wine Whenever (08:20.469)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (08:35.364)
That's crazy. A day. A day. And then at other points, was on like methadone, Xanax, and a cord of vodka would be like his daily prescription. So it was just crazy. That's a lot of drugs. And he said he would go to open houses on Sundays, you know, real estate open houses, and he would like raid people's medicine cabinets.

We Wine Whenever (08:36.255)
Day?

We Wine Whenever (08:50.411)
That's a lot of drugs.

We Wine Whenever (09:04.083)
Wow.

We Wine Whenever (09:04.776)
Yeah, crazy. And during one 90 day detox, he had a grand mal seizure and he was down to like 128 pounds.

So it's just very sad. In 2018, his digestive system shut down and his colon exploded. And he had to be put on what's called an ECMO machine. I'm not sure what that stands for, but I'm pretty sure that something like, it controls your heart, it has a vent on it. It's like super heavy duty. And he was given a 2 % chance of making it through the night.

We Wine Whenever (09:39.778)
Yes. Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (09:47.812)
And then of the five, yeah, of the five people that were put on this machine that night, he was the only one to survive in whatever facility he was in. So he was in a coma for 14 days and hospitalized for five months. And during that whole time, was, he was never alone in his room, never. There was always a medical personnel or a family member in his room. And doctors had to wait.

We Wine Whenever (09:48.888)
my gosh.

We Wine Whenever (10:16.974)
a year and a half to even be able to do surgery on him to fix his colon.

We Wine Whenever (10:24.275)
Was this after the show wrapped?

We Wine Whenever (10:26.756)
I believe, yeah, was after, yeah. Yeah. So he ended up having 14 surgeries and a bunch of dental surgeries. So I later on, when you see him in interviews, he's kind of talks kind of funny, almost like slurring a bit, but it's due to his dental procedures that he had to have. And supposedly he met the ketamine queen.

We Wine Whenever (10:27.01)
Yeah, because it was in 2018, you said, right?

We Wine Whenever (10:30.291)
Okay, okay, yeah, so that's way after, okay.

We Wine Whenever (10:32.695)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (10:47.423)
Mmm.

We Wine Whenever (10:56.986)
Vasine, I have her last name written down, but it's not in front of me. He met her in a rehab because he was in rehab with Charlie Sheen's ex-wife and Charlie Sheen's ex-wife was best friends with one of the people that we'll learn about in a little bit. His last name was Fleming and he was the broker for this, you know.

We Wine Whenever (11:07.031)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (11:25.83)
this ketamine queen in Hollywood.

We Wine Whenever (11:29.449)
So she was the ketamine queen and she was in the rehab. Was she in the rehab to get people, like to get drugs? Like, right? She certainly wasn't in there to get clean.

We Wine Whenever (11:33.462)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (11:37.724)
Probably. Wouldn't, isn't that a great idea? No, no. So.

We Wine Whenever (11:40.033)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (11:44.734)
No. No.

We Wine Whenever (11:45.543)
Got it. Like she's in there as a patient, I mean. Okay.

We Wine Whenever (11:49.08)
She was probably there fishing and gathering clients. Because as we will learn, this is something that's very prevalent in the rehab world. It's not all what it's cracked up to be. So in all, he was in over 6,000 AA meetings. He was in therapy for 30 years. He was in detox 65 times and he was in

We Wine Whenever (11:49.142)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (11:52.605)
Right. Got it.

We Wine Whenever (12:01.779)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (12:18.684)
15 rehabs. So half of his life he was in treatment or sober living houses. It's crazy. It's a lot. So in 2022, he wrote a self-help book called Friends, Lovers and the Big Terrible Thing. And

We Wine Whenever (12:27.746)
That's a lot.

We Wine Whenever (12:29.269)
That's a lot,

We Wine Whenever (12:43.76)
He states that he came to realize that addiction is an obsession of your mind, which then becomes progressive in your body. And in an interview that I watched, he quoted from an AA book and said it was a very powerful statement that always stuck with him. And it's this, drinkers think they are drinking to escape, but what they are really doing is trying to get over a disease that they don't know that they have. They have a mental disorder that they don't know that they have.

And he also quotes, think you have to have all your dreams come true to realize that they are the wrong dreams. You know, he said that he always had this emptiness inside him and he really thought that being a successful actor was just gonna, you know, once that happened, it would be all good. And then once it did happen, he was like, no, I'm still miserable. So, which is.

We Wine Whenever (13:42.079)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (13:42.958)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (13:43.682)
really very sad. And he said that writing his book was very cathartic, but he said having to read it for an audiobook for an audiobook was excruciating. He said to write the words down was therapeutic, but to have to say them and really know that he was actually talking about himself is that was a very, very difficult. So

We Wine Whenever (14:02.271)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (14:09.71)
Okay, so this was the interview that he had, this guy named Tom Power. And Tom Power asked him, how do you want to be remembered? And Perry answered that I lived well, I loved well, I was a seeker and always wanted to help people. When I die, I don't want friends to be the first thing that's mentioned. I want it to be my book.

We Wine Whenever (14:35.226)
which I was very sad and very telling. So during an interview with Diane Sawyer, he was asked, she said, how are we to know when you're in trouble and you're not okay? He said, if I say I'm just gonna chill at home alone tonight, or if I ever say I'm cured, that's when you know that there's a problem. So in the end,

We Wine Whenever (14:35.62)
That's sad.

We Wine Whenever (14:36.756)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (15:02.862)
He grew up wanting to belong and to be noticed due to his lonely childhood. And he struggled and he survived only to be in the end only wanting to help others, but no one ended up helping him. Which I think is really very, very, very sad, very sad because when you look at the timeline of events, I think one of the most guilty person involved in everything was his PA.

We Wine Whenever (15:16.181)
Mmm.

We Wine Whenever (15:17.377)
Yeah, it's very sad.

We Wine Whenever (15:32.06)
was his personal assistant.

We Wine Whenever (15:32.659)
Well, I did not realize that that guy was with him for 25 years, his personal assistant.

We Wine Whenever (15:36.931)
Yes. Yes.

We Wine Whenever (15:37.082)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So...

We Wine Whenever (15:41.149)
I mean, if you don't have this guy's best interest, I mean...

We Wine Whenever (15:45.028)
Yeah, what a piece of shit.

We Wine Whenever (15:46.018)
I, know, Hollywood's an evil place as we're learning.

We Wine Whenever (15:49.391)
Yes it is.

We Wine Whenever (15:49.921)
Yes, we are learning that. what the reason we decided to do this podcast is because Laurie had seen TMZ was doing a special, like an investigative reporting about his death and kind of what happened. So the three of us all watched that and then Laurie did some additional research to see kind of where he started and how he wound up there. And one of the things we saw in the Harvey Levin TMZ

We Wine Whenever (16:03.388)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (16:18.168)
you know, special was, there's this guy, Nick Matthews, who's also a part of this special. He is a CEO of Stillwater Behavioral and Summit Malibu Recovery Centers. And he was a very interesting guy to learn about. He tells his story and he had met Matthew Perry before. So that's, you know, he's been in the world and he met Matthew Perry. But by the time this guy was 20, he was strung out all the time and decided he didn't want to live anymore.

And one day, and it doesn't happen like this for most people. So he is the exception, not the rule. And he was one of the lucky ones. He jumped on a plane and went to recovery center and that was December 9th, 2013. And he's been sober ever since. So for him to go, decide I need help, go get the help and for it to work and last is amazing. It's amazing. And he's a success story. Yes, it is an anomaly. It is.

We Wine Whenever (17:03.188)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (17:10.972)
That's an anomaly.

We Wine Whenever (17:14.569)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (17:16.575)
And then he said, in the beginning, he would go to two to three meetings a day, two to three meetings a day. And he would see, you know, he would see Matthew at meetings and he kept to himself and he could see him at the meetings that he was surrounded by enablers, including his personal assistant, you know, the people that were around him wanted to be around him because who he was and they wanted to make him happy and they wanted to do whatever it is, you know, he wanted.

We Wine Whenever (17:27.029)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (17:40.82)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (17:46.578)
And he said that, you know, there's this secret celebrity drug ring. And I didn't know anything about it. Did you guys know anything about it?

We Wine Whenever (17:57.3)
No.

We Wine Whenever (17:57.73)
Nope, not surprised, but no, I did not. hey, listen, celebrity is not really my circle, so how would I know? I'm in the backwater here.

We Wine Whenever (18:00.722)
I'm not surprised either.

We Wine Whenever (18:05.493)
I know exactly. mean, I mean, we see Kelly Osborne talk about it and the things that Kelly Osborne had to say were shocking, shocking. know, 54 years old drowned in the Jacuzzi, but that wasn't the real cause of his death. The real cause of his death was he overdosed. And

We Wine Whenever (18:06.643)
Yeah, right.

We Wine Whenever (18:11.573)
You

We Wine Whenever (18:16.888)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (18:17.779)
Very shocking.

We Wine Whenever (18:35.539)
You know, I didn't know this until actually he had passed away is that Keith Morrison is his stepfather, you know, the investigative reporter. And, you know, he talked a little bit on the show and he's done a lot of pieces about, you know, not very informative investigative pieces. And I'm sure he had no idea to the extent of this either because, you know, when you're hiding something, you're not going to let

We Wine Whenever (18:44.826)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (19:04.648)
the people that you love see you this way, you know, you're gonna have your staff see you this way.

We Wine Whenever (19:10.153)
That's the thing. Yeah, like he had so many people around him that like our kids, if we call our kids, they're gonna, well, they might not pick up the phone, but if somebody picks up the phone, it's gonna be them. If in their world and their celebrity world, it doesn't, know, if his mom calls him, it doesn't necessarily have to be him picking up the phone. could be anybody and be like, he's doing this, you know, like covering for him.

We Wine Whenever (19:21.565)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (19:31.814)
He's indisposed. Mm-hmm. Yes. So they actually said that when he died, he had the equivalent amount of ketamine in his system required for anesthesia.

We Wine Whenever (19:32.221)
Right.

Right. Right.

We Wine Whenever (19:44.039)
Yes, that's what the coroner's report said.

We Wine Whenever (19:47.836)
crazy.

We Wine Whenever (19:48.435)
And when they raided the ketamine queen's house, that's, I think you have that Lori, how many like pounds of drugs she was charged with?

We Wine Whenever (19:54.557)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (20:01.294)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I have all that. Because what I did was I made a whole separate notes on all the cast of characters, each of the people. So that's where I put her info, or her naughty side.

We Wine Whenever (20:09.076)
Each of the people, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (20:13.444)
Yeah, let me see. here she is. she was, I can't pronounce her name, a Jaswine Sanga, and she was 41 years old. She was a dual citizen here and in Great Britain. You said her employment was listed as a chief financial officer of the now closed studio city salon called Stiletto Nail Bar.

We Wine Whenever (20:37.372)
which I believe was where she just laundered her money. That was just front.

We Wine Whenever (20:41.477)
Exactly. Exactly. That was just her front. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (20:42.303)
I'm sure.

I'm sure.

So she distributed ketamine and other illegal drugs from her stash house in North Hollywood since at least 2019. The LA Police Department executed search warrants at her house where they found evidence of drug trafficking, including approximately 79 vials of ketamine, which is approximately 1.4 kilograms or 3.1 pounds of

orange pills containing methamphetamines, phacyclopin, mushrooms, cocaine, prescription drugs. Like she had a whole pharmacy, which is insane, insane. And she had previously been arrested in March on a separate federal drug case. So, you know, she shouldn't have, right. yep. She was released

We Wine Whenever (21:28.004)
Yes, it is insane.

We Wine Whenever (21:38.406)
for ketamine distribution.

We Wine Whenever (21:45.52)
from custody with $100,000 bail that was posted.

We Wine Whenever (21:49.525)
And but but but that was the cause of another man's death, right? Yes.

We Wine Whenever (21:52.484)
Yes, yes, exactly.

We Wine Whenever (21:53.442)
yeah.

We Wine Whenever (21:56.944)
Now she's facing a minimum of 10 years in federal prison and a statutory maximum sentence of life. She's there without bail, which good, I'm glad she's there without bail because she's certainly a danger to society. And her trial is set for March 4th, 2025.

We Wine Whenever (22:12.138)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (22:22.842)
So, you know, there was doctors involved in this also.

We Wine Whenever (22:30.992)
Well, you know what, it's that allure of fame and fortune for medical professionals. They almost become like side hustlers in legal and illegal drugs, and they market them to the rich and famous who have big pucker books. So the doctors start mingling with celebrities. They almost want to become celebrities themselves. And they all hope to become, I think it was...

We Wine Whenever (22:38.13)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (22:58.0)
Kelly Osborne that said this, they all want to become like the next doctor du jour, you know, like who is a doctor that you go to for this or that to get a specific drug. And no, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (23:03.54)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (23:10.179)
Yeah, she did say that.

We Wine Whenever (23:11.605)
Even the one doctor's secretary was on, right, or medical assistant, and said she went to a party with him at some celebrity's house, and they walked into the house, and there was like a whole, there were bowls of pills all over the place, and she said he basically wanted to go to hobnob with celebrities.

We Wine Whenever (23:18.625)
yes. Yep.

We Wine Whenever (23:19.235)
with

We Wine Whenever (23:26.126)
right in a candy dish.

We Wine Whenever (23:30.524)
Yes, you know, because a lot of people in the medical field have really good intentions in, you know, in their calling to care for patients. But also you have to keep in mind that a lot of doctors are very narcissistic and kind of like low key sociopaths. It's a very, I know people who have been married to doctors and it can be a very bizarre, bizarre thing that happens to them.

They just become, it's like a God, yeah, it's like a God complex. Yeah, it's a God complex.

We Wine Whenever (24:00.361)
Well, I'm sure it's a pretty big ego boost once you get to put that doctor in front of your name.

We Wine Whenever (24:05.345)
Yeah, definitely, definitely, definitely. So after his death, there was five people that were charged. His assistant, Kenneth, I can't pronounce his last name. It's, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (24:08.186)
So.

We Wine Whenever (24:17.405)
I can't read. I will, I will master.

We Wine Whenever (24:20.664)
I will monster. And once you say it a couple of times, you get it.

We Wine Whenever (24:23.946)
Okay, so he took a plea deal to avoid a 15 year sentence. Dr. Mark Chavez also took a plea deal. Dr. Placenia Plancenia, I don't know. He pled not guilty and the Placencia. yeah, Dr. P, okay. He did not take a plea and I mean, he probably wasn't offered one. They didn't need to. Yeah, didn't, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (24:24.35)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (24:38.502)
Placencia, just Dr.

We Wine Whenever (24:41.961)
So he did not take a play.

We Wine Whenever (24:48.145)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (24:48.521)
Maybe the other two gave enough information where they're like, yeah, you're going down.

We Wine Whenever (24:53.078)
But it's the ketamine queen who's really going down because there's no plea for her either. it's sad because they really all should be held accountable. And like you said, his assistant who took a...

We Wine Whenever (24:53.126)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (25:05.98)
Yeah, I mean, the guy was 60 years old. mean, come on. It's not like some naive 20-something year old who's got this great personal assistant job. You know, he was like, he was 59 years old. He was previously a PA to Angela Bassett. And, you know, come on. You really should know better. I just think he's real piece of shit. That's what I think. So Chavez.

We Wine Whenever (25:16.82)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (25:22.283)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (25:30.313)
Yep. Yep.

We Wine Whenever (25:34.328)
this Dr. Mark Chavez. He was an ER doctor from San Diego. He's 50. So he's kind of like a hustler. Like he sold exercise equipment online. He wrote like a self-help book. And he went into business with two other doctors and he opened it up this thing called Dreamscape Ketamine and Wellness. So after he had like a dispute with them, he left the practice and he took a supply of ketamine with him. And then he rented

did something really weird, like he rented this room in a home in La Jolla and like sold the ketamine out of like this rented room. It a low budget. And then he obtained more ketamine by submitting fraudulent prescriptions in the name of a former patient and then purchased more ketamine through a wholesaler and the guys are still being affiliated with that dreamscape.

We Wine Whenever (26:12.693)
Peace.

We Wine Whenever (26:29.957)
So.

It's just crazy town, but that the two doctors Chavez and Plasencia knew each other for like 20 years. So Plasencia, yeah, Plasencia, I believe it was, was the one who found out that Perry wanted the ketamine and then he contacted the Chavez to get it from him. So this, Dr. Salvatore Plasencia,

We Wine Whenever (26:42.409)
Hmm. Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (26:43.464)
That's interesting.

We Wine Whenever (27:01.584)
He was a family and internal medicine doctor in Santa Monica. He's 42. And during the pandemic, he opened a telehealth company. And so he's been charged and arrested with one count conspiracy to distribute ketamine, seven counts of distribution of ketamine, two counts of altering and falsifying documents or records relating to the investigation. And he...

faces a maximum sentence of 120 years, 20 years in federal prison. Isn't that crazy?

We Wine Whenever (27:35.848)
I wonder if he's the doctor that said that Matthew Perry was a moron. Because one of them...

We Wine Whenever (27:40.499)
Yeah, let's see how much we can get this moron to pay.

We Wine Whenever (27:41.628)
I believe that was him. I believe that was him.

We Wine Whenever (27:45.032)
I hope so. hope it's, yeah. Because it is, it's egregious like to say something like that. I mean, this is a human being and you're a medical professional. You know what this can do. You know what this can do to somebody.

We Wine Whenever (27:46.302)
I hope so too.

We Wine Whenever (27:49.007)
So.

We Wine Whenever (27:53.338)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (27:57.262)
absolutely. But the best is he posted bail of $100,000, but he is still practicing medicine in Calabasas. has a, in Calabasas, he has an urgent care facility. So he did not lose his medical license, but he cannot prescribe controlled substances. Is that crazy?

We Wine Whenever (28:23.529)
Yeah, but that doesn't mean he can't get it and give it to people. How about when Kelly Osborne said, when, I always forget his name, the TMZ guy, Rick Levin? Harvey Levin. I'm thinking of Kelly Dodd's husband. Harvey Levin, when he asked her, has anybody from the medical board contacted you yet? And she said,

We Wine Whenever (28:35.56)
Harvey Levin, Harvey Levin, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (28:48.962)
No.

We Wine Whenever (28:50.064)
Yeah, no, I know this

We Wine Whenever (28:51.945)
because somebody called her doctors out for overprescribing, right? One doctor called other doctors out.

We Wine Whenever (28:57.572)
Yeah, so her

Yeah, her deal started when she had her tonsils out and they gave her Vicodin. She's been in rehab seven times and she said her first rehab was like becoming a better drug addict university. It was like a class on how to be a better drug addict. And she still...

We Wine Whenever (29:19.164)
Yes. Yes.

We Wine Whenever (29:20.223)
This is, the system is so broken that this is why people don't wanna send their kids to rehab. Like if your kids got a problem with weed, like you don't wanna, people say don't send your kid to rehab for weed because they're gonna come out with a PhD in heroin. Like that's the scariest thing in the world. The system is so broken. So you have that aspect of it. Then you have, you know, once somebody turns 18,

even if it's court ordered for them to go to rehab, they can sign themselves out. This is another problem. And then you hear that the rehabs are sending people to NA and AA meetings to basically sell them drugs and get them hooked again so they can go back to rehab.

We Wine Whenever (29:53.916)
Right.

No, it's crazy.

We Wine Whenever (30:07.77)
Yeah, they're actually called body brokers.

We Wine Whenever (30:09.352)
Well, that's, mean, they're not sending, they're not sending them to re to NA and AA. They're going to the AA and NA meetings to recruit people back. But NA and AA meetings are good places to go. So I'm, I don't want people to think like, don't go there. Like they are good places to go. Yeah. Like they're good places to go. It's these, these people that are sending recruiters, body brokers to get them back, to try and get them hooked again.

We Wine Whenever (30:27.734)
no, of course, of course.

We Wine Whenever (30:27.756)
yeah, no.

We Wine Whenever (30:37.786)
Yeah, I mean, this is sick. Sick.

We Wine Whenever (30:40.23)
Yeah, it is sick. It is sick.

We Wine Whenever (30:40.508)
Yeah, well, listen, this is what I want to know because a lot of these places, it's like $100,000 for a month, these celebrity rehabs. So my question is, these body brokers, I wonder what their commission is on each catch. You know, each person that they get to, you know what I mean? It's crazy.

We Wine Whenever (31:00.477)
Right, right. I'm sure very high. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (31:06.522)
sure it's not that high to be honest with you. Even if it's 10 percent. Like I'm sure it's not that high. You know? It's because it's not that hard. You're going to a place where addicts go to get better and you're offering them drugs to get them hooked again. Like you're preying on the weakest of the weakest of the weakest. It's like come on. You know have a conscience. Like how do you look at yourself in the mirror?

We Wine Whenever (31:10.345)
Right. Right.

We Wine Whenever (31:26.847)
Yeah!

We Wine Whenever (31:36.873)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (31:36.88)
It's, it is sad. really is sad what, goes on. And I'll be honest with you, like I've seen some of this stuff firsthand. I have a family member who's been in different treatment facilities for different things. And these treatment facilities are very expensive. They're very expensive. And a lot of times they just want to keep you there so that they can get the money.

We Wine Whenever (32:04.49)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (32:04.71)
You know, that's what their main goal is, not so much to get you better so that they can collect the money. yeah, and some of the people that are working in these places are, they're not, they're not licensed, you know, they're not licensed. They're babysitters themselves, like, you know, watching these patients. I know even, you know, what's his name? Jack's said that the

We Wine Whenever (32:10.512)
the picture.

We Wine Whenever (32:34.386)
the facility that he went to, Jack's Taylor in California. Now, he said he left the facility to go work out with a nurse. I I hope that that's the case because a lot of these places, they leave the patients alone with not medical professionals, without nurses, with just people that are bodies to watch them. Because I've had, like I said, family members at these places and they're there for certain substances and the people around them that are working there are doing those substances.

We Wine Whenever (32:53.45)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (33:04.857)
So, you know, they're not getting better. They're seeing that, you know, you can work around the system and learning things that they never learned, you know, didn't know existed. And it's very sad.

We Wine Whenever (33:14.623)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (33:14.96)
That's why Blake, it is sad. What's her name?

We Wine Whenever (33:19.797)
Well, it's sad, especially when somebody makes the commitment to try to get themselves better. Like that's a huge, huge thing.

We Wine Whenever (33:26.494)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (33:29.756)
Yeah, well, it's like Kelly Osborne was saying that when she was in rehab, she saw patients like demanding, you know, I have to have an ambient so I go to sleep or I'm having an anxiety attack. I have to have Valium. And then they kind of like threaten the center. You know, well, I'll just sign out and then you'll lose your hundred thousand dollars for the month. So a lot of times they're, they do what the, you know what I mean? So.

We Wine Whenever (33:44.595)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (33:54.76)
Right, right. They do what they want. More enabling, more enabling. Kelly Osborne also said that she went to her first rehab at 19 years old and that she remembers the first time that she met Matthew Perry. He walked up to her and he gave her a chip that said three minutes. He said you, because she was having a tough time. She was really struggling. He said you can get through three minutes.

We Wine Whenever (34:00.122)
They do what they want.

We Wine Whenever (34:01.513)
Right, right.

We Wine Whenever (34:22.12)
you can get through anything. And Kelly said it got her through the day and then the next day and the next day. And she'll never forget that. And at one point she was going to six different doctors, one in LA, two in LA, two in New York and two in London, just to get what she needed. She would just call the doctor herself, get the refills. Harvey's like, well, you would go in and pick up the prescriptions yourself? She goes, yeah.

I would go in and pick up the prescriptions myself.

We Wine Whenever (34:53.909)
And she was what 13, 14?

We Wine Whenever (34:55.54)
Well, she was 13 when she started doing, but yeah, she was a minor. She was a minor. Now, can you imagine? I mean, I can't even get Sudafed without showing my driver's license. You know what I'm saying? Like, can you imagine?

We Wine Whenever (35:07.507)
Right. Right.

We Wine Whenever (35:07.568)
Yeah.

Well, it's that whole elite world of when you got money, you can break all kinds of rules. So did you guys see on the TMZ thing that Brandon Novak, he was a guy from Jackass. He said he would actually go into doctors offices and like trade swag for drugs.

We Wine Whenever (35:15.306)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (35:16.98)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (35:19.903)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (35:29.616)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (35:36.316)
So I saw he was on this, I watched this podcast, was called Studio 22. And he was on it and he was talking about himself a little bit. So he started out as like by 16, he was like a full blown heroin addict and he was a skateboarder. And then he grew up with another guy who was a skateboarder who became famous. And then that guy kind of took him in.

We Wine Whenever (35:36.767)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (35:37.158)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (35:56.185)
gosh.

We Wine Whenever (36:05.44)
And so he was a millionaire three times over by the age of 23. And he never went from Jackass. Yep. Yep. And

We Wine Whenever (36:12.233)
This guy Brandon Novak was? Just from the Jackass movies?

Man, Eric really missed his calling with that. Son of a bitch. He was the original jackass jumping off roofs.

We Wine Whenever (36:19.42)
He did. did. Yes, he did. So he, yes, yes, he was. So he was in rehab 13 times by the time he was 35. And like Perry, his addictions almost killed him. So it's just crazy town. And then we saw on the same TMZ, Mike Sorrentino from Jersey Shore.

We Wine Whenever (36:20.976)
Hehehehehe

We Wine Whenever (36:27.132)
you

We Wine Whenever (36:49.286)
So.

We Wine Whenever (36:49.444)
Yes. Yeah. He talked about his addiction and he's just announced that he's opening his own recovery centers and the first one is going to open up here in New Jersey and, but they're going to be nationwide and it's called our Archangel because he's Michael the Archangel. He's calling himself St. Michael. Yes. But you know what? He's done a lot of good things.

We Wine Whenever (37:07.167)
St. Michael.

We Wine Whenever (37:09.636)
It's so funny. Yes.

We Wine Whenever (37:12.207)
he's done a lot of great things. He really, really has. I mean, talk about pay it forward. Like I couldn't, I couldn't say enough good things about him, honestly.

We Wine Whenever (37:15.225)
Yes, he really has.

Yes.

We Wine Whenever (37:23.876)
Also Terry Dubrow was on that special and you know he's a board certified plastic surgeon and he knows about the lure of the celebrity but he doesn't need to do that like he has enough business he has his own you know clout but you know he he gave it he corroborated what other people were saying you know as a doctor he sees this happen all the time.

We Wine Whenever (37:26.483)
Mm.

We Wine Whenever (37:27.302)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (37:51.012)
in Hollywood because he is a doctor in Hollywood and he sees these parties. who else was on? Dr. Drew Pinsky was on and he said, it's the doctors that are fueling these addictions of these patients. They do what they want to do and they know that they are not the only game in town. So they'll do whatever the patient wants because if they don't do it, somebody else will.

We Wine Whenever (38:00.318)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (38:00.571)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (38:19.603)
Right. And then, and then they lose their clout and they lose. Right.

We Wine Whenever (38:20.26)
And you know,

We Wine Whenever (38:20.289)
That's what I'm saying.

We Wine Whenever (38:23.119)
Right. Right.

We Wine Whenever (38:23.29)
Yeah, like I said, they want to be the doctor du jour. They want to be the doctor that everybody comes to for their extras. Because it's a lot of money. It's a lot of money.

We Wine Whenever (38:32.617)
Right. Yep.

We Wine Whenever (38:32.666)
Right. No, it is a lot of money. It was the first time I heard this. Dr. Anne Klein is just as responsible for Michael Jackson's death as Dr. Conrad Murray. Dr. Klein shot him up with Demerol every day for the last three months of his life. Every day. Not Anne Klein, Arnie. I'm sorry, Dr. Arnie Klein.

We Wine Whenever (38:52.348)
Like who does that to somebody? I don't care what you would pay me.

We Wine Whenever (38:58.005)
I'm like, Aunt Klein, doesn't she make loaves? I know, I know.

We Wine Whenever (38:59.138)
No, no, Arnie, I'm sorry, it's dark. My eyes. And Dr. Klein. So Debbie Rowe, the interesting thing is Debbie Rowe worked for Dr. Klein.

We Wine Whenever (39:00.667)
Hmm.

We Wine Whenever (39:10.505)
That's who it was. That it was Michael Jackson's ex-wife who worked for the doctor. Yes.

We Wine Whenever (39:14.778)
Well, they weren't married. She just had his baby.

We Wine Whenever (39:17.973)
She said I'm Michael Jackson's ex-wife. She said it. I'm almost positive they were married.

We Wine Whenever (39:19.886)
really? I thought she just had his baby. Alright whatever I mean I know she definitely had one of his babies but yeah whatever yes.

We Wine Whenever (39:21.116)
Cool.

We Wine Whenever (39:28.071)
I agree, but I honestly thought she said Michael Jackson's ex-wife or maybe they put it underneath her name.

We Wine Whenever (39:34.116)
Okay. So for 27 years, and she said, she's the one who said she was very familiar with these medications and that she would go to the parties and he supplied the candy dish full of pills. Dr. Arne Klein is the one who, you know, supplied them. And, you know, why hasn't anyone looked at him? Why is he still walking around? No, no.

We Wine Whenever (39:34.95)
just

We Wine Whenever (39:45.523)
Yes. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (39:55.517)
He didn't get arrested in all of this? I, you know what? I thought, I just assumed he was one of the doctors that got arrested in all of this.

We Wine Whenever (40:04.87)
No.

We Wine Whenever (40:04.986)
Well, all one can do is hope that...

The many, many, other people involved in this will be brought into the light. That's all one can hope because it's really disgusting.

We Wine Whenever (40:18.623)
Well, I'm sorry, but at this point, shouldn't the, I'm sure there's a federal medical board. I'm sure, you know, I know that each state has one, but I'm sure there's a federal level. Well.

We Wine Whenever (40:31.312)
I don't think so. I think the way the, and I could be wrong. I think the way the medical board runs, there is a medical board, know, the AMA, the American Medical Association, right? But you know who's on the AMA? Other doctors. So doctors are policing doctors. So this is what happens. This is what happens. And there's no federal oversight. It's the AMA, which is the, and they're, it's doctors policing doctors.

We Wine Whenever (40:46.33)
other doctors. So it's just a big...

We Wine Whenever (40:47.197)
Right.

Yeah, see, and this is a.

We Wine Whenever (40:56.084)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (40:59.891)
Yeah, no, it's time for the feds to get their shit together and put together a group of non-doctors to monitor this and for sure do some investigation into the whole LA drug ring because this is insane. I mean, it explains so much when you think about it, like, Brittany Murphy, who was the other guy? He was so cute.

We Wine Whenever (41:07.804)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (41:24.422)
Britney Spears.

We Wine Whenever (41:28.915)
Well, I'm saying people who just died and there was no explanation. Heath Ledger, like River Phoenix, like come on. Like we know, you know.

We Wine Whenever (41:34.586)
Yeah. Mm-hmm. No, there's so many people who have, yes. Yeah. So.

We Wine Whenever (41:43.709)
You know there were people enabling them. Doctors.

We Wine Whenever (41:46.427)
Yep.

We Wine Whenever (41:46.812)
Yeah, definitely, definitely, definitely.

We Wine Whenever (41:52.166)
So I did.

We Wine Whenever (41:52.398)
When Mike is on this show, he's talks about, okay.

We Wine Whenever (41:57.285)
No, no, it's okay.

We Wine Whenever (42:00.34)
Okay, when Mike was on, he started talking about how he started experimenting with opiates when he was 19 years old. A friend had introduced him to these yellow pills and they were called bananas. And he got them on the street and he fell in love with them. And that was 10 milligram Percocet. And that's where he fell in love with opiates. And that's where he said the devil started. The first season they cast him on Jersey Shore, he was just drinking.

and was proud of that. But by the second season, after they got the big raise and he drank a little bit of his own Kool-Aid and said, wait until you see me now. And in season five, it really came to a head when he was smuggling the drugs, which he talks about in his books, to Italy in his shoes, his sneakers, and he ran his head into a cement wall and he was out, he was high, he was out of control.

We Wine Whenever (42:48.83)
sneakers.

We Wine Whenever (42:58.163)
And then in 2013, he went to rehab and he is nine years clean and sober. Actually, that's 2013, so it's 2024. now it's 11 years, right?

We Wine Whenever (43:03.388)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (43:04.053)
I'll pass.

We Wine Whenever (43:08.661)
11 I don't think you

I don't know.

We Wine Whenever (43:14.899)
And he credits his wife, Lauren, who was his girlfriend, college sweetheart, and just wanting to get better. But again, he's the exception. He went to rehab and got clean and sober, just like the guy who started it out, Nick Matthews, went and it worked.

We Wine Whenever (43:23.903)
College sweetheart.

We Wine Whenever (43:31.571)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (43:36.053)
But Mike Sorrentino, he went to rehab a couple of times. he, you know, it wasn't like that guy. That guy really is an exception to the rule, for sure. Mike did a couple of stints.

We Wine Whenever (43:47.716)
Yeah, but I believe Sontino only went maybe like, yeah, but maybe only like two or three. But I didn't realize that a lot of people who are addicts, there's multiple times to rehab, like over and over and over and over again. And you wondered to yourself, is it really that their addiction is so bad?

We Wine Whenever (43:48.317)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (44:04.208)
yeah, many many many times.

We Wine Whenever (44:14.244)
Or is it that these rehab centers are really fucked up?

We Wine Whenever (44:19.989)
So obviously, you know, I lost two nephews to drug overdoses and a brother-in-law. When I say the system is broken because people can sign themselves out, that is what I'm talking about. My brother-in-law signed himself out lot. Went a lot. So, you know.

We Wine Whenever (44:37.745)
Yeah. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (44:38.428)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (44:41.925)
Listen, I smoke cigarettes and I'm trying not to buy them and I'm trying not to smoke because I turned 50 and I know I got to get my shit together, but I just walked over and had one with my friend, my other friend who smokes. So it's a weak moment, right? It's a weak moment. So people in rehabs can have a weak moment and just sign themselves out and just change their whole path in one weak moment.

We Wine Whenever (44:58.033)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (45:06.236)
trajectory.

We Wine Whenever (45:10.393)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (45:12.069)
even if it's court order you can sign yourself out.

We Wine Whenever (45:15.599)
But the problem with it is, what are you going to do? can't hold them hostage. Yeah, can put them in jail. That's the only thing you can do, but what are you putting them in jail for? I don't know that that part of it is the broken system, because what else can you do? You can't hold people against their will.

We Wine Whenever (45:23.496)
No, I know.

We Wine Whenever (45:43.774)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (45:44.366)
You can put them on a cycle, but if they're not, you know, it's hard. It's very, very hard. It's very hard.

We Wine Whenever (45:50.506)
Yeah.

Nevermind the fact that these places are so overfilled. They're so over, they're so overfilled. Like, you know, sometimes you can't even get a bed. You're just, you're, you have to wait. Like you've gotten to the point where you actually make the choice to get yourself help, which is tremendous. And you can't even get in because there's no beds available.

We Wine Whenever (45:57.979)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (46:05.068)
No, absolutely.

We Wine Whenever (46:16.7)
It's crazy though.

We Wine Whenever (46:17.496)
But what they said about, what you said Matthew Perry said about the drugs, the addiction, it was really about mental health. And I'll be honest with you, think every, almost, actually I think every single one, I think every single addict or alcoholic has a co-occurring mental health issue. Now that being said, I think that you can have a mental health issue and not

We Wine Whenever (46:27.812)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (46:28.117)
Sure, of course.

We Wine Whenever (46:46.721)
have an addiction issue. But I do believe if you have an addiction issue, you most definitely also have a co-occurring mental health issue. And that's where it is tricky because trying to decipher what is the addiction and what is the mental health issue and then how do you treat it because the ketamine is actually an effective treatment

We Wine Whenever (46:48.996)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (46:49.033)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (47:16.374)
for certain mental health issues. If it is done, no, it is, no, it absolutely is. No, it absolutely is under medical supervision. There's a place on Route 9 in Howell that does it, but it has to be medically supervised. My problem with it is, is the fact that, like I said, mental health issues

We Wine Whenever (47:19.551)
But it's not like FDA approved for that though, right? I thought they said that it was not in the TMZ thing.

We Wine Whenever (47:32.819)
Okay. Okay.

We Wine Whenever (47:46.75)
and addiction issues are co-occurring. So if you prescribe ketamine for someone who has anxiety or depression, and they also happen to be an addict, that's what's gonna happen. If you happen to prescribe it for somebody who does not have this addiction problem, and it does not have this addictive personality, then it may work for them, right? But who, like,

We Wine Whenever (47:49.49)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (48:02.036)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (48:11.957)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (48:15.542)
how do you figure that out? And do the doctors really care enough to figure it out? Because like I said, it is mainstream. There are places, I could walk into a place right now with someone I love and I could probably get them this ketamine therapy. it's not, right, exactly. It's not always the right thing. And it's a very slippery slope.

We Wine Whenever (48:18.0)
Yeah, who has what?

We Wine Whenever (48:33.03)
to what end?

We Wine Whenever (48:37.491)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (48:42.835)
Yeah. All of these medications should be doctor supervised. You know, to not have a licensed psychiatrist monitoring your medication, it's negligent.

We Wine Whenever (49:02.212)
Yeah, well, but this is what happens.

We Wine Whenever (49:03.208)
Yeah, absolutely. It happens.

We Wine Whenever (49:04.159)
But there are doctors in this area right here that are prescribing anxiety medicines, general practitioners, prescribing anxiety medicine to people and not putting them under a psychiatrist's care to monitor it.

We Wine Whenever (49:19.504)
which is not cool. Yeah, no. So I just wanted to bring this up. So.

We Wine Whenever (49:20.829)
It's happening. No, it's not because it.

We Wine Whenever (49:26.282)
Well, you know what the other problem?

Good.

We Wine Whenever (49:30.562)
On September 30th, this Dr. learns of Matthew Perry's interest in ketamine and he contacts this other doctor, Dr. Chavez, to obtain the ketamine. So you go back and forth and if you look at the timeline, they meet again on October 2nd. He gets more injections. October 4th, he gets more injections.

And then October 6th, more injections, October 8th, they actually meet in the shopping plaza late at night and this Dr. P injects Matthew Perry in a car. October 10th, again, they meet. And then pretty soon, his personal assistant, this Iwamasa,

starts to inject him instead of the doctor. So then you go to like October 20th, Matthew Perry receives his last legal ketamine treatment from his regular physician. And then October 25th, he's, you know, now he's starting to get it from this Fleming person who is in cahoots with the ketamine queen. So now he's not only getting it from this Dr. Plasencia,

We Wine Whenever (50:35.066)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (50:58.5)
Now he's getting it from this guy, Fleming, who is the drug mule for... Right, and now the personal assistant is the one giving him the shots. Okay, so you go October 25th, October 26th, October 27th, October 28th. Now the day that he dies, he gave him three injections in one day. So just to give you some reference, in one month...

We Wine Whenever (51:04.179)
and now the personal assistant's the one giving him the shots.

We Wine Whenever (51:07.047)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (51:27.836)
So from September 30th until October 28th when he dies, Matthew Perry spent $43,000 on Ketney.

We Wine Whenever (51:40.881)
Crazy.

We Wine Whenever (51:40.934)
That's crazy. Crazy.

We Wine Whenever (51:43.569)
Crazy.

We Wine Whenever (51:43.637)
September 30th, so a month, he spent $43,000 on ketamine.

We Wine Whenever (51:46.906)
Yes, $43,000 on

We Wine Whenever (51:53.02)
And I also heard somebody say that really the wholesale thing on a vial of ketamine is like $12. But they'll charge like $2,000 for one vial, whatever they can. So it's just very sad. Very, very sad. Because in the end it was just somebody who... Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (51:53.851)
Yeah, it's crazy.

We Wine Whenever (52:08.007)
Whatever they can, whatever they can.

We Wine Whenever (52:18.709)
So the personal assistant on the 28th gives him injections, leaves the house to run errands, and leaves Matthew Perry in a jacuzzi shot up with ketamine.

We Wine Whenever (52:26.521)
Mm-hmm. Yep. That's exactly what happens.

We Wine Whenever (52:28.433)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (52:31.101)
I mean, that's liability right there. that's, it's very clear. You left him in a...

We Wine Whenever (52:35.009)
huge! That's what I'm saying.

Yeah, that's why I'm saying when you look at the timeline of what his personal assistant really did, it's so heavily negligent. It's just, what a piece of shit that you would, this is somebody that you worked for for all this time and made a good living off of him. And that's how you would pay him back.

We Wine Whenever (52:51.731)
Yeah, yes.

We Wine Whenever (52:56.783)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (53:05.151)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (53:06.298)
You know, whatever happened to just saying, you know what? I love you, Matt. I can't do this. I quit.

We Wine Whenever (53:13.183)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (53:13.955)
Yeah, let's go somewhere. Let me take you to get help.

We Wine Whenever (53:16.442)
Yeah, let me call somebody. And even if he says no, you call somebody anyway.

We Wine Whenever (53:16.789)
All right. All right.

We Wine Whenever (53:24.023)
Right. Call his family. Call his family. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (53:24.176)
Like that's Cole Stanley. Yeah. Who, who does that? Who just keeps injecting somebody like that's crazy.

We Wine Whenever (53:33.891)
It's crazy. It is crazy. One of the things I was going to say is another part of the problem, like you had mentioned, is these general practitioners are prescribing these drugs. There's not enough psychiatrists. And that's, yes, yes, that's another part of the problem is that there are not enough psychiatrists. There really isn't. It should be, especially for adolescents. And you know,

We Wine Whenever (53:46.416)
There's not, and it takes months to get into one.

We Wine Whenever (53:47.247)
No, there's not.

We Wine Whenever (53:53.193)
Yes, that's true. That's true. Especially for adolescents.

We Wine Whenever (53:59.035)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (54:02.645)
It does take months to get to see them and...

We Wine Whenever (54:04.686)
And then when you do get to see them, and I have personal experience, again, myself also from family members, when you do get to see them or speak to them when they're, you your telehealth visit, you're on the phone for 10 minutes, they're just re-prescribing your medication. how are you, gone. It's...

We Wine Whenever (54:30.259)
Is this, it, do you think it's helping? Do you think, you know, do you think the dosage is okay?

We Wine Whenever (54:33.892)
Yeah, but they not like not like a great big conversation, not like really giving a shit. They're reading like three questions off a piece of paper so they can hang up with you and get on the phone with the next person and re up their script.

We Wine Whenever (54:53.207)
another very sad effect.

We Wine Whenever (54:53.665)
Yeah, it's sad, but that being said, there are some very good psychiatrists out there because I have personal experience with very good ones and ones that are very bad. So, you know, there are good ones out there. Same goes with therapists, to be quite honest with you. And that's the other thing is, you know, mental health treatment is not just medication. Therapy and medication go hand in hand. You can't do one without the other.

We Wine Whenever (54:58.17)
yes if you could find them.

We Wine Whenever (55:06.396)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (55:12.223)
Absolutely.

We Wine Whenever (55:22.95)
without the other, yes.

We Wine Whenever (55:23.583)
You can do therapy without medicine, but you can't do medicine without therapy. They have to go together. They have to go together. And that general practitioner doesn't get that. Doesn't get that portion of it.

We Wine Whenever (55:27.676)
Correct.

We Wine Whenever (55:37.98)
So, I mean, I don't know. I think that really it's very sad. It's an epidemic. know, addiction is an epidemic and things need to change.

We Wine Whenever (55:52.376)
And this just proves like when they say addiction has no discrimination, this guy had more money than he probably ever knew what he'd have to deal with. You know what I mean?

We Wine Whenever (56:02.782)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (56:03.268)
Yeah. And don't think.

We Wine Whenever (56:05.557)
It really doesn't matter your social class, your financial class. It hits you, it hits you. And you could have the most loving family or you could have an unfortunate upbringing. It doesn't matter. Because I'm sorry he felt, and I don't think his addiction had anything to do with the fact that he came from divorced parents and got shuffled back and forth. don't, you know.

We Wine Whenever (56:11.568)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (56:19.184)
come from a mess. No.

We Wine Whenever (56:22.314)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (56:33.959)
I think that a good therapist probably, if he was in therapy all those years, he probably came to terms with that and it's nothing his parents did. They just didn't get along and they separated and moved on. And I'm sure both of his families loved him very much. I, know.

I just think that if it's in you, it's in you. It's in your DNA, it's in your makeup.

We Wine Whenever (56:58.268)
Well, that's always a question.

We Wine Whenever (56:58.642)
Yeah, and the sad part about it is...

We Wine Whenever (57:04.383)
Is it nurture or nature? Is it environment or, you know, biology? But the other thing is, you know, this is the stigma with addiction because even mental health illness, there's a stigma with it. You know, if you tell someone you're an addict, they look at you one way. If you tell someone that you have cancer, they look at you another way. And guess what? They're both deadly. They are both deadly. And, you know, to think that you can control it or to think that they can control it.

We Wine Whenever (57:06.48)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (57:06.696)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (57:13.706)
Sure.

We Wine Whenever (57:25.535)
Yep. Yes.

We Wine Whenever (57:27.164)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (57:32.922)
It's just ignorance. It's ignorance.

We Wine Whenever (57:34.855)
I totally agree. It's not a choice. It's not what they're choosing. They're not choosing to live this way. They're not choosing to hurt their families. Of course not. They wouldn't choose that. Right.

We Wine Whenever (57:38.49)
And I

We Wine Whenever (57:42.141)
No.

We Wine Whenever (57:44.89)
and themselves. I did look up though, because I was very curious when, you know, when I started doing all this research in regards to his assistant, I was like, I wonder what was in Perry's will, you know, like, because you think to yourself, well, why would something you do? No, but no, he was not in it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (58:03.215)
of course, especially in Hollywood. Really?

We Wine Whenever (58:08.51)
Good.

We Wine Whenever (58:12.144)
But I just think, you know, it's just really sad. We've seen all this stuff about Hollywood and fame and I'm just, I'll just be a nobody in brick. I'm good. I'm good.

We Wine Whenever (58:28.277)
You got it. I'm with you. We'll do our little podcast every week.

We Wine Whenever (58:30.096)
You know, who wants to be involved in all that? Yeah. That no one listens to it's great. Okay. I know it's a joke. It's a joke.

We Wine Whenever (58:36.885)
Yes they do. We do.

We Wine Whenever (58:37.842)
We have people listening now. We have someone from Denmark who listens to us. Any comments? Yes.

We Wine Whenever (58:45.046)
yay, Denmark, hi!

We Wine Whenever (58:45.45)
Yes. And we appreciate the feedback. Last year we could say that, but this year I don't think we could say it anymore.

We Wine Whenever (58:48.652)
How nice. Okay.

We Wine Whenever (58:51.227)
Yeah. No, we're getting there. We're growing. We're growing.

We Wine Whenever (58:55.176)
So fun. Yeah. All right, Mr. Denmark, we love you.

We Wine Whenever (58:55.327)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (59:00.54)
Yeah, we do. He does. Yes.

We Wine Whenever (59:00.669)
Yeah. Yes. He gives good feedback. They give good feedback. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (59:03.804)
nice. Very nice. All right. Well, when we're in Denmark, we'll look them up.

We Wine Whenever (59:09.508)
All right, sounds good.

We Wine Whenever (59:10.857)
Laurie will be the first one to get to Denmark out of the three of us, by the way.

We Wine Whenever (59:13.186)
that's for sure. That's for sure.

We Wine Whenever (59:13.66)
Absolutely. Denmark, I come. I'm ready.

We Wine Whenever (59:19.804)
Ha ha ha!

We Wine Whenever (59:20.127)
I still haven't been out of the country once.

We Wine Whenever (59:22.748)
we gotta fix that.

We Wine Whenever (59:23.128)
Kelly, yeah we gotta fix that. We gotta get her on a plane. Yeah. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (59:25.821)
Yeah, that'll be our first big trip.

We Wine Whenever (59:28.11)
Okay. yeah.

We Wine Whenever (59:31.007)
You know what? That's gonna be the first feat. I'll tell you that right now.

We Wine Whenever (59:33.946)
Yes, the plane. The plane will be the first.

We Wine Whenever (59:35.76)
Well, how about a big boat? Can we cruise you someplace?

We Wine Whenever (59:38.906)
Yeah, how about that?

We Wine Whenever (59:40.639)
Big fan of cruises either. We'll figure something out. I don't know. I don't know.

We Wine Whenever (59:41.948)
Well, how are we gonna get you out of the country?

We Wine Whenever (59:42.492)
How do you know? How do you know you're not a fan of cruises if you were never on one? How would you know?

We Wine Whenever (59:49.2)
Ha ha ha.

We Wine Whenever (59:51.986)
I've seen Titanic. I didn't love the ending. I'm a scaredy cat, I told you. I'm a scaredy cat.

We Wine Whenever (59:53.781)
gosh.

We Wine Whenever (59:57.054)
god damn it.

We Wine Whenever (59:59.228)
Hahaha

We Wine Whenever (01:00:02.32)
do with her, Wendy.

We Wine Whenever (01:00:04.228)
All right, do we have anything else to talk about about this subject or you think we're good?

We Wine Whenever (01:00:09.454)
I think we're Absolutely.

We Wine Whenever (01:00:09.587)
Listen, we just pray for anybody who suffers with addiction and their family members, because...

We Wine Whenever (01:00:12.165)
We do.

We do.

We Wine Whenever (01:00:16.753)
It is not easy going through it and it's certainly not easy losing anybody.

We Wine Whenever (01:00:17.125)
It's a lot.

We Wine Whenever (01:00:20.788)
No, and we should, we'll put a link in our podcast for places you can go for help and numbers that you can call. So you're not alone. There are people out there that will help you. So just remember that. Thank you for watching. No, definitely not, definitely not. Thank you for watching and listening to We Wine Whenever. Until next time, bye.

We Wine Whenever (01:00:34.456)
Yeah, nothing wrong with reaching out.

We Wine Whenever (01:00:44.671)
Bye.

We Wine Whenever (01:00:45.69)
Bye.